Spiritual Mediums, Right and Wrong, Partners Who Don’t Meditate

Spiritual Mediums, Right and Wrong, Partners Who Don’t Meditate

[00:45] Q – Are spiritual mediums communicating with people who have passed away?

I attended an event where a spiritual medium passed on some messages from my late mother. The details were too specific to be coincidental, but the message was vague enough for me to doubt that it was really my mother. I have two questions on this.

Are spiritual mediums genuinely communicating with people who have passed away? And if this is possible, why can’t we all do this?

[01:11] A – Accuracy and Purpose of Mediumship

These are all very pivotal questions, very pivotal questions. I don’t like black-and-white answers to black-and-white questions. I like to think of things in extent. So that is to say, what is the percentage of accuracy?

Certainly, there are mediums— Isn’t it interesting we call them mediums, but we call the media “media,” which is actually the proper plural for the word, but it would be very strange to refer to a medium as in plural media.

There are mediums who have some spontaneous capacity for contact with people who have left their bodies behind. And by the way, that’s going to be everybody on Earth eventually because the death rate on Earth, in case you haven’t realized it, is 100% so far.

Then we have to ask the question, what is the value of doing that? Someone’s consciousness has dropped their body and is moving into the next phase, which is the restful phase, which is in advance of the next phase, which is, once again, returning into a baby body and having another shot at living a life in which you can gain enlightenment where enlightenment was not gained in the previous life.

And so, to what extent is it valuable to interrupt the program in which a disembodied soul or spirit—in Sanskrit we use the word jiva, J-I-V-A, jiva—to what extent is it relevant or responsible to interrupt the program of the jiva who has left the body behind, and to attempt to bring them back into contact with all the relativity that they’ve left behind, for fulfilling whatever needs we might have, who are still here on the earth, wondering what our loved one was experiencing?

[03:26] A Misunderstanding of What It’s Like to be Dead

You see a little bit of an angle going on here in my description of this. There’s a certain degree of selfishness in it, and a medium could have the capacity to have a degree—and a degree might mean 10%, 15%, 100%, whatever—of capacity for contact with a Jiva. But those Jivas are not just hanging around in space waiting for somebody from the earth to reach out and contact them. They have an agenda and they’re experiencing their agenda.

And, so then, is it possible that some jiva is desperately seeking a medium through whom they can speak to and communicate with their non-medium loved one on the earth? This is not really considered to be the way things go in the Vedic worldview.

A desperate jiva who’s just looking for somebody who might have the capacity to communicate a question or an unfulfilled desire or some advice or something from “Beyond” so that some loved one who’s left behind is able to benefit from the greater wisdom or to hear exhortations of love or whatever it is from the Jiva.

This represents a misunderstanding of what it’s like to be without a body. I don’t like using the word dead, and I’ll tell you why. Because dead is a word that we use to describe consciousness, which has simply dropped a body—it’s dropped its outer shell. And we use the word dead because we don’t really understand what’s going on, and so we put all of these consciousnesses in the same category, the dead.

[05:30] Communicating from One State to Another

Death, actually, is not real. It doesn’t have a reality. Bodies certainly peel off and go back into dust or whatever it is they’re made of, carbon, but consciousness continues. So if consciousness continues, is that death?

And so then, first of all, we have to ask, why are we so fascinated by the phenomenology of interrupting the agenda of those who’ve already, pointedly, drop their bodies, whether they seem to have intended to at the end of a long life or with various degrees of they weren’t intending to but they did anyway. Body gone.

What is the basis of the curiosity? And I’m going to put it to you that there’s a degree of selfishness involved here.

Are there mediums who have this capacity? Yes, there are, to varying extents.

And it’s a little bit like this: supposing somebody you love moved to the next state over. You lived in Nevada, and they moved over to Utah. And there’s somebody who lives on the boundary between Nevada and Utah. And you want to get a message to your friend who’s moved over to Utah, or a message from your friend who’s moved to Utah, but you can’t directly communicate with them for some reason.

So you go to the person who lives on the boundary between Nevada and Utah, and you say, “Excuse me, can you get a message over to my friend?” And they do. And then, “Can you get a message back from my friend?” And they do.

[07:13] How Exact Are the Medium-Delivered Messages?

The interesting thing is: how exact is it going to be? Because it’s filtering through the consciousness of the person who lives on the boundary between Nevada and Utah.

Are they really getting across exactly the way you feel and the way you experience and how you behave, and so on, to the other party in the other state? And when the other party from the other state responds and it moves through that person who lives on the boundary land to you, to what extent is it exact?

Now we know the answer to this, and I’m putting it to you this way because the answer is, not so exact, actually. We don’t have that much to go on to say that somebody gets across an exact message, an exact feeling, even here in the living world, to say nothing of the world where you’re making an inquiry here, embodied, and you’re making an inquiry across the state boundary through a medium, through person who stands between, to somebody else who’s over on the other side, interrupting their program .

“Excuse me, I have a message. I know you were having your lunch over there, but I have a message from somebody in the other state, and here’s what it is. Would you like to give me a reply? I’ll run back over to the boundary and give that person your reply.” You see the exactness of all this?

[08:40] Vedic Meditation is More Effective Than Seeking Messages from the Departed

From the perspective of the Vedic worldview, there are people who can get in contact with these spirits, but the power that can be gained in life from someone who’s lost their body, the knowledge, the power, the capability, the value that could be gained, is an infinitesimal fraction of the value that can be gained by simply closing your eyes and meditating and going into the unbounded consciousness field yourself.

During the practice of Vedic Meditation, we have the ability to go within and make contact with Totality Consciousness and to derive our knowledge from that, which is the goal of whomever it is that dropped their body, that lost their body, dropped it or lost it, whatever, body gone. The so-called dead. Those consciousnesses who are seeking rebirth so that they can do what you’re very capable of doing yourself.

Close their eyes and learn to meditate. Once they get out of the diapers, and they get through a bit of schooling and whatever, they come across a meditation teacher who can teach them how to do what you already know how to do. And that’s what all those jivas are seeking. They’re not seeking going back to the people and the forms and the phenomena of the life they’ve already left.

They’re not interested in coming back here. They want to move forward.

[10:16] Limitations of Mediums in Spiritual Communication

And so, there may be somebody who can kind of tap them on the shoulder, as it were, and say, that’s the medium, “Excuse me, I have an inquiry from somebody on the earth.” And then that consciousness is being interrupted.

Why are we doing that? Does that consciousness have the capacity to check in on you from time to time if they wish to and to give you a blessing or to give you some little message themself? Yes, they do. Why are you going through some other person?

If we’re going to have some communication, some communing, with someone who is on the agenda of moving to the next body, that’s what they’re doing, let’s not interrupt them. But, if we’re capable of ourselves receiving any kind of message from a loved one, why not be a direct recipient to whatever extent? Why go through a third party?

And it’s not going to be for the reason of getting it exact, because third parties don’t deliver messages in any exact form. As a person who stands on the boundary land between Nevada and Utah—not the very best source of information.

Do they exist? Yes. Are they accurate? In percentages, some more accurate, some less accurate. Is it necessary, useful, or even desirable? Definitely not.

Self-sufficiency. Let’s awaken our full consciousness ourselves, and let’s let everybody progress and evolve on their own terms. You see, there’s a part of us inside that is the loving controller.

[11:55] Controlling Behavior Towards the Departed

I’ve talked about it in many other podcasts: I’m a controller, but I’m loving. I’m controlling people for loving reasons. I want to even control the dead and interrupt their experience and say, “Excuse me, you haven’t paid attention to me for a while. Will you come back here and tell me you love me again? Excuse me, where’s my hug? Excuse me,I know you might be evolving to the next body, I just want to be sure I know you’re okay. Because it’s important to me to know you’re okay.”

You see all of this? This is controlling behavior. We need to let go of that controlling behavior here on earth, and we certainly need to let go of it with regard to anybody who’s already left their body. We need to stop being controllers of any kind, and including the most subversive of all the controllers, which is the loving controller, who excuses all their behavior because they consider it to be so loving, all their controlling behavior, so loving.

So, once we let go of the need to control, we’re going to let go of the need to make constant inquiries. We’re going to let go of the need to be in contact with people who’ve dropped their bodies.

If those people have anything to say to us or any message to give us, we are awakening our full consciousness through regular twice-a-day practice of Vedic Meditation. Let them come to us, themselves, and they can deliver a message themselves, self-sufficiency.

[13:29] Let Go of the Need to Control and Embrace Self-Sufficiency

And if we hear nothing, it doesn’t mean we’re not loved. It means that we need to be loving enough to allow whomever it is that’s left the earth to get on with coming back here again. And they will get on with coming back here again. That’s the law of Nature. We don’t try to tie a string onto them. 

When you mail a letter, you see what you do, you take the letter to the mailbox—this is a thing we used to do that barely exists anymore, so I have to describe it to people—you take a letter in an envelope and you put it in the mailbox. Don’t try to tape a little string onto it to make sure that you can be sure the mailman picked it up and took it off, so you feel the string tugging.

“Oh, they must’ve picked it up now. Oh, they must’ve delivered it. Oh, cut the strings. Mail the letter. Cut the strings.”

So we have to be willing to let go of our own selfish desire to see to what extent we can have an influence on the consciousness of someone who’s dropped their body.

That’s a controlling behavior. Let’s let go of all of that. Let’s be easy, natural, self-sufficient, self-reliant. We’re open to everything, but we don’t need mediums.

Jai Guru Deva.

[14:49] Q – Is There a General Right and Wrong in Life?

Jai Guru Deva. Thom, thank you for your time and your guidance. I want to ask you if there is general right and wrong in this life. I know everybody has a path, but is there more reason for us to pursue a life of academic study and learn about the secrets of this world to better it, or is it okay to pursue pleasure and party? Or, seek revenge when you feel as if you’re wronged?

I guess my question comes from, at times, feeling as if I struggle going between a higher calling and catching myself sometimes, and my emotions, and feeling like I can make a decision that would be totally against some of the things that I’m learning on my spiritual path.

Thank you for your time.

[15:50] Q – The Paradox of Right and Wrong

This is a very beautiful question, and a questioner whom I hope I can meet one day, you’ve got such an interesting voice. Thank you for your question and the sincerity of it. So sincere.

What we need to do really is to take all of this in your question out of the realm of our individuality. My individuality has to figure out what’s right. My individuality has to figure out what’s wrong. And the problem with all of this is that something that’s right, right now, in this 15 seconds or so, may, 15 seconds later, be completely wrong.

What is right or what is wrong is all about what it is that is supporting the process of evolution, life-supporting, or damaging to the process of evolution, life-damaging, at what time and in what context.

[16:54] The Bhagavad Gita

You’re going to find it very interesting, and I strongly recommend you listen to my discourse in September on the subject on the text known as Bhagavad Gita.

Bhagavad Gita. I’ve recorded separately a discourse on the subject of what is Bhagavad Gita, and I’m going to have with my highly educated colleague Jamie Hood and I will be together exploring the meaning of the Bhagavad Gita.

Bhagavad Gita means the song of God. It is a treatise that was laid out some 5,000 years ago, where Arjuna, who is the protagonist of an epic story, asks his guru, Lord Krishna, ” What is it that’s right? And what is it that’s wrong?” in a context of a battle scene in which Arjuna is really between a rock and a hard place.

He is charged with the responsibility of destroying the destructive power of his own cousins, with whom he grew up. And if you believe in justifiable vengeance, he had many reasons to feel vengeful, but he didn’t. Instead, he felt compassion. And yet, if he didn’t kill them on the battlefield, they were going to succeed in debauching the entire Vedic civilization and destroying the knowledge base for all future generations to come.

And it was a little late for him to try to be a pacifist because he had an army of millions that were behind him, marching on an army of millions across the no man’s land on the other side, and there was no possibility for a diplomatic solution. All the combatants were eager to fight, and a few loose arrows had already flown overhead.

[19:08] Thinking From the Narrow End of the Funnel

And so there was going to be an engagement. And in the midst of all this, Arjuna says to his master, Lord Krishna, “What’s right here and what’s wrong? I know it’s wrong to kill. But if I don’t kill, my cousins are going to kill millions and destroy an entire knowledge base that in future generations could stop wars and bring an end to suffering. What do I do now?”

Krishna gives him the advice that I’m going to give you, my listener, which is transcend all of this. You have to stop being an individual. You have to stop being… I should rephrase that: You have to stop being merely an individual.

Individuality is necessary for universality to carry out its intention. Individuality is a very necessary thing. It’s the narrow end of the funnel. You know how a funnel is shaped? That big, wide end, and then it cones down into that applicable end. The wide end of the funnel is the catchment end that catches whatever it is that’s going to be funneled down into the narrow neck of the funnel to apply it.

We think of ourselves as a funnel but too much, we think of ourselves as being only the narrow neck, only the applicable end. And the applicable end, trying on its own, without being aware of the broad end of our funnel consciousness, tries just on its own, just through the individuality, to figure everything out.And the Vedic view is, you cannot. It’s too complex. 

All of the different influences and forces that exist at any given moment are so vast in number that it’s likely that any logical decision you arrive at or, even indeed, a heart-based decision, at which you arrive in any given moment, is likely to have so many different aspects of it that inadvertently are life-damaging if you engage. Even though there’ll be some life-supporting that comes out of your engagement in action, there’ll be some life-damaging.

[21:41] Spontaneous Right Action

How do we get spontaneous right action? And I think this is basically what your question comes down to. Do we get it through book learning? Do we get it through trying to be a good person?

We can’t get it through any of these things, actually. We get it from ceasing to be merely an individual, taking our awareness into the broad Unified Field consciousness, and inhabiting that consciousness in our practice of meditation twice each day.

Be without all of these individualized forces. This is the message given by Krishna in Chapter 2 Verse 45 of Bhagavad Gita: ” Be without all of these balancing agents that are balancing, unbalancing, and rebalancing themselves continuously.”

Step beyond all of those things and come back here into the source of Being. Transcend, step beyond all of this. Experience oneness with Totality, and from there you will receive, when you open your eyes and come out of meditation, on a moment-by-moment basis, you’ll receive the clue, the hint of in what direction to move and also in what direction not to move. Individuality then becomes an instrument of Totality Consciousness.

This is the knowledge that has to come out. Individuality, actually is cosmic as well as being individual. Individuality is cosmic.

This is the whole summary of the Vedic body of knowledge. Take the individuality out of being merely individual and allow the individuality to be representative of cosmic intent. And we do this through our practice of meditation twice each day. That’s the solution.

Jai Guru Deva.

[23:52] Q – Can a Vedic Meditator be in a Relationship With a Non-Meditator?

Hi Thom, Jai Guru Deva. This is Katherine from New Zealand. I have a question about being in a relationship with a partner who is not yet interested in learning to meditate. And I’m sure you get this sort of question all the time. And the reason that I’m asking it today is that recently a very experienced meditator told me that they thought that being in a relationship with a non-meditator was essentially doomed, and that really was quite upsetting to hear.

And I wondered, would you have given a similar opinion? And if not, what would your view be on being a meditator in a relationship with someone who isn’t a meditator yet, and hasn’t yet expressed any interest in becoming one?

Jai Guru Deva. Thank you.

[24:46] A – We Want the Pizzaz

Jai Guru Deva. What a sweet heart you have, such a beautiful heart. And don’t listen to your meditating friend about this relationship that you have with your partner. It’s not true. It’s not doomed or anything like it. We’re not in relationship in order for both of us to be the same thing. If two people are exactly the same, one of you is not needed. It’s the difference that actually makes a relationship something kind of spicy.

You know, you have some food, and maybe it’s a little bland, so you sprinkle a little salt on it, and it gives it some pizzazz. And, too much salt wrecks the meal. No salt at all, very bland. We want the pizzazz.

I think it’s perfectly fine for a meditator to be in relationship with a non-meditating person and it’s a very frequent thing. All it really is, is somebody who’s regularly having a deep inner experience of the Self, and you are, in fact, performing meditation for two people, because your partner is benefiting, by your mere presence and by your own meditation, they’re benefiting from your practice.

I’ll tell you what I think is non-sustainable: two non-meditators in a relationship. That’s completely unsustainable. At least one meditator in a relationship, completely sustainable.

As long as you continue your practice, you continue your practice, and, you know, in any relationship, at every moment of every relationship, there’s a dynamic between the two. And the dynamic is one of you, in any given moment, is more conscious in that moment than the other.

[26:56] Consciousness Dynamics in Relationships

Shall I repeat it? I think I shall. At any moment in a relationship, as time is flowing, moment by moment is going by, between the two of you, in a given moment, one of you is more conscious than the other is. And that means one of you is the one from whom the other will be learning something.

One of the things that meditation gives us is the capacity to recognize teachable moments, where somebody has made a worthy inquiry and is actually interested in a different perspective or our point of view. We don’t foist it on people. We’re not proselytizers. We’re not missionaries. But if somebody has demonstrated that they have an interest in a different perspective on what they’re experiencing, and they make an inquiry for your point of view, that’s a teachable moment. You give it.

But, another thing that happens to us as meditators is that we spontaneously develop a greater willingness to see the point of view of another, and the other may exercise a teachable moment with us. We don’t consider all people who don’t practice Vedic Meditation to be ignoramuses. I admire many people, many people, who have no interest in Vedic Meditation at all. 

There are lots of people I admire, whose capacity to have a grasp of the way the world works, or the way the universe works, or the way that the natural world works, or who have deep insights into literature, or deep insights into mythology, who’ve never come anywhere close to inquiring about Vedic Meditation. And yet I admire them, and I learn from them, and I might even quote them.

[29:03] Embrace and Learn from Each Other’s Views

So we don’t want to put people who don’t yet practice Vedic—and see how I say “don’t yet, don’t yet”—don’t yet practice Vedic Meditation into a kind of a box of people who are all the ignoramuses of the world, and you can’t have anything to do with them. No, no, no.

As Vedic meditators, it is incumbent upon us to find the good in everybody. If somebody meditates, that’s great. We’re happy for them. If they don’t meditate, we’re always open to helping them fulfill that inquiry if it ever comes.

And one of the ways that we’re going to maximize opportunities for them is by ourselves being radiant. Enjoy the wisdom and radiate life for all to enjoy, and that includes our partner.

And be open to learning from your partner. Be open to learning from those teachable moments on your partner’s behalf when your partner is the one who, in any given moment, might be more conscious than you.

More conscious—what does it mean?

It means a greater ability to be aware of a larger number of things all at one time. That’s what being conscious means. And sometimes it’s you, and sometimes it’s your partner.

And so we have to be ready to receive wisdom and knowledge from our partner. And as Vedic meditators, we have a greater capacity, we know that. We gift ourselves twice every day with a greater capacity to be open, a greater capacity to learn, a greater capacity to give and to be perceptive and to be aware of the moment.

[30:46] Being Different Makes Relationships Better

And, so all is well in your world. Just, you keep meditating. Let your partner be the beneficiary of your meditation. If your partner ever ends up learning Vedic Meditation for themselves, that’s a super bonus. We’re happy enough that we practice it; that’s all. We’re not missionary people, and we are not excluders. We’re not into excluding people.

Naturally, it gives us joy when somebody begins to have an experience that is something that we’ve enjoyed. That’s natural. But people don’t have to be like us.

We’re in relationship because we enjoy differences, that’s all. We don’t want somebody to be the exact mirror image of us, that’s too boring. You can stand in front of a mirror all day and just praise yourself. Praise what you’re wearing. “Look at you. You’re really just the best.” Who wants to have a relationship with a mirror?

So when we open our eyes, we want to see somebody who’s different to us. We don’t want to see ourself. We have enough of ourself. That’s why we’re in relationship. So, all is well in your world. Take it as it comes. It’s all good.

Jai Guru Deva.